Do you think it's really all that surprising that Iraq detainees are being abused and killed, considering people who voluntarily join the military have no problem with violence?
WASHINGTON - The investigation of the treatment of prisoners from the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq has recently uncovered 12 more detainees who have died in U.S. custody. Defense officials told reporters that the Army had investigated the deaths of 32 detainees in Iraq and five others in Afghanistan since August 2002, 12 more than the Defense Department reported two weeks ago. The victims are from 33 separate cases, two of which involved more than one death.
Nine of the cases remain open, and eight of those are classified as homicides, NBC News’ Tom Busby reported. Those deaths, six of which occurred in Iraq, are believed to have followed assaults by U.S. soldiers before, during or after interrogations...
Ok, whoever wrote this question has the IQ of a stapler. The question should read "Do you think it is surprising that people who once stuck a "United We Stand" bumper sticker on their cars are now writing stupid questions belittling American soldiers who risk their lives to defend us against terrorists and protect human rights?" (The answer should be YES). All of you anti-military/anti-American idiots are extremely ignorant. You just sit there and hide behind your computers and insult the people who are fighting so that you don't get killed the next time you go to work, get on a plane, or take your kids to school. The people killed in captivity were terrorists, who probably would've died when they crashed a gas truck into a daycare. It's unfortunate, but it's reality. Welcome to the real world.
^^IQ of a stapler? I'm thinking more the IQ of a Number 2 pencil.
"only complete morons want to join the military to fulfill their dream of being the big man instead of the dumb loser they really are." marybone, congratulations on posting one of the stupidest comments in the thread. If ignorance is bliss you must be multi-orgasmic.
"they don't believe in solving problems without using violence" kiki, "they" would be the President, NOT the military. We're an option that the Commander-in-Chief employs should diplomatic efforts fail in whatever the circumstance might be. Military personnel don't initiate strategic policy. Those of us in the military (I'm assuming this but I'm pretty confident that it's true) didn't join just to kill someone. Killing is inherent to the role of military personnel, sure, but there are a myriad of reasons why people join...a sense of patriotism for one's country, a marketable job skill (not all jobs are infantry), a s
sense of adventure, etc. The bottom line with me when it comes to comments made about the military is that it doesn't bother me IF the comment isn't made in a derogatory manner (re. marybone). Joining the military has been a rewarding experience for me over these past 19 years. It's not a career for everyone.
So now I'm anti-American and anti-military because I don't think we should be allowed to treat people like animals?
I love how that's how you people take it - that's how people in the military are though. They assume that just because you don't agree with their practices, that you hate America and hate the troops, when really THAT is where the ignorance comes into play.
You can't say anything to justify to me what happened in those prisons, even though some people on this thread have tried. I am aware that the vast majority of people in the army aren't like that. But to try to justify the behavior of the rest - it's not going to fly around me. What they did is sick and wrong, and they are the ones that are animals. And those who saw the abuse and were too chicken sh*t to stop it or say anything aren't much better. I don't respect THOSE troops, no. Not a bit. Just the ones that are representing me and my values.
Oh, I wasn't putting you down, kiki. That wasn't my intention and I don't think that I did. If so, I apologize, I agree that the soldiers involved with any looting or any violation of ethical behavior need to be identified and dealt with (to include leaders who turned a blind eye).
Ok, kiki, If you had done your homework, and took the time to become educated on a subject before you posted your opinion, (which was probably given to you by the mainstream media) you would have realized the use of the prison at Abu Ghraib before the Americans took it over. Let me enlighten you for a moment. Abu Ghraib was used as a place for authorized cruel acts of torture. People had their fingers cut off, tongues sliced with razors, limbs battered and broken. Not to mention the rape rooms. (you're a female, you can imagine the horror of rape.) You won't hear any of this on the news, because the liberal media wants to make our soldiers look bad, further discrediting our President.
I don't know what you meant when you said "you people." I'm not in the military, I just support what our country is doing. Sure, we have a few soldiers who crossed the line, but that doesn't give you or anyone the right to question the integrity of the American Armed Forces.
To clarify, I am also disagreeing with their behavior and believe they should be dealt with. I just wish people wouldn't project the shortcomings of a few onto the entire American effort in Iraq. (and, in your case kiki, assuming that all American soldiers are violent killers)
^yes it is. there should be no prisoners. there should only be statistics for KIA. im tired of babysitting these ignorant, uneducated, sub-human pieces of trash. i wish we would pull all of our troops out of the middle east and just flatten the entire area.
On remarks like taphophile though, people are still people, these trash that you are mentioning are human beings. Nobody deserves to just be shot or destroyed just because there are some that are just sick and evil people.
I agree that these people (terrorists) are sick and demented because they actually believe in they're cause and would happily die for it. They are extremely intelligent and they know what they are doing. But there are also little children and other innocent people who unfortunately have to live in these places that you would rather just blow up. And so I just don't agree with you on that. But I can understand the frustration because we're losing alot of our own, but I still don't agree.
I am not speaking of all Arabs, just those extremists who are at war with the world. Don't you two get all in an uproar.
Peepers, for someone who knows absolutely about the military, you sure are popping off more than your share on this thread. Hitler my ass, you pompous moron. I suppose you support the killing of American civilians?
Estella, again, I repeat, I am speaking of these so called militants who are killing OUR innocent civilians. Or, is it OK if innocent Americans get killed, just as long as we don't kill any innocent Iraqis?
To spite Michael Moore, I'll download his movie online...just to see how distorted the "facts" are in the movie. I've only seen clips on tv, and I'm wondering if the Marine Corps allowed the Marine in the film to be in it, especially how the guy is against operations in Iraq (or so I gather from the clips I've seen).
How is that spiting him? He has ASKED people to download his movie
The Marine in the movie is, more or less a deserter I guess. He is facing military prison because he refuses to go back to Iraq to kill innocent women and children. I was very, very impressed with that young man, standing up for what he believes in. Even though his own government is willing to send him to prison for it
Crap...he asked ppl to download his movie? Just to spite him I WON'T download it now.
"to kill innocent women and children" is a pretty strong generalization to make. That's akin to my saying all Iraqis who don't care for the US are insurgents. I wish I could find some objective data on how many women and children have been killed by US forces since Operation Iraqi Freedom began. I know it happens, but I wonder if it happens less often than we think.
As for the Marine, nobody put a gun to his head to sign his enlistment contract. Secondly, he could've pushed for conscientious objector status (although I don't know the odds of that status being approved for him). His oath of enlistment commits him to his obligation as a Marine or face repercussions under the Uniform Code of Military Justice. He could've finished out his tour and THEN protested all he wanted to. It wouldn't surprise me if he decided he didn't like the Corps and is using the war as his "out.
I think the deal with the Marine was that he used to be for the war, and used to want to serve, but after his first time in Iraq he realized he couldn't go back. He said he didn't even feel human after killing women and children, and that he could never go back and face it again. Normally I agree that they sign up for it, but I think with him it was more just a matter of changing his mind.
I've found out more about the downloading thing though - apparently someone asked Moore if he thought downloading his movie would be a crime, and Moore said as long as they weren't making a profit off his hard work, it seemed okay to him. Someone took that quote and told everyone that it meant Moore was encouraging people to download it, when that wasn't the case. He's not asking people to download it, he's just saying if they do, he wouldn't be mad as long as they weren't gaining anything from it.
Any idea what unit the Marine was in, or what his name is? I'd like to find out what type of unit he was deployed with. Anyone can come back from a deployment and convince the rest of us that they actively engaged in combat. Maybe the guy was telling the truth that he killed innocent women and children, but I tend to be cynical when the statement is made to support someone's political view regardless of which end of the spectrum the view supports.
In the earlier post about downloading his movie, I was joking about doing that...I had no idea Michael Moore had no problem with ppl doing that.
Getting back to the issue of US forces in Iraq, I do have my own personal views, and not all of them are exactly in keeping with what the current Administration's mindset. I just take issue with military personnel publicly balking the Command, especially while in uniform. Knock yourself out and do it in civilian attire, just as long as you don't state you're in the military.